- Vientiane Travel Report Dated Added: Mon Dec 17 2007 Submitted by: Goodstick
Laos is a very nice place. Compared to other Southeast Asian countries, it is quiet, and most importantly, people are peaceful. It is the country where I feel most safe. People are not aggressive or cheating (I am talking about people in the tourist industry: tuk tuk drivers, girls.). The problem is English. The number of people who can speak English here is quite small, even in hotels, restaurants, bars. In Vientiane, I made friend with two young tuk tuk drivers in front of my hotel. Since these guys park their tuk tuk here daily, everybody knows them. (Review # 22151)
One night, one of them took me to a residential area where I was told by the owner of the house to wait for the girls to arrive. The house looked nice and safe, although it was rather dark. I just did not like the idea of waiting for half an hour just to see only one or two girls. My experience on this kind of delivery service is that most of the time, you'll have to settle with a rather bad looking girl. So I said to the tuk tuk to take off. He drove me to a hotel called "Vientiane Royal Hotel" (I can't remember exactly the name, but it definitely has the word "Royal" in it, outside, its name is also written in Chinese). Anyway, it is an upper mid-range large hotel with a beautify lobby.
The tuk tuk driver talked with the receptionist then took me to the second floor (I think) where there were many karaoke rooms. We did not come here for karaoke, which I hate anyway. So I just waited at the tiny bar. It was about 11:00PM and I was the only guest there. All the girls were busy singing with their guests (mostly Asian business men) in the karaoke rooms, so I did not see any of them. But after a while, a young girl came out for a quick break. She did not look too good, so I said no to the tuk tuk driver's suggestion.
Ten minutes later, another girl came out. This girl was about 22, nice face and slim body. I nodded. The driver negotiated the price for me. It was about $90 for the whole night (the girl later had to share some of the money with the driver when we got back to the hotel). Anyway, she said I had to wait until she got off from her job. I sat there drinking beer and talked with the young bar tender, who happened to be a college student during the day time.
The atmosphere was very quiet and relaxing. During that time, more girls came out from the karaoke rooms. They were all young, most gorgeous. I almost regretted that I made my decision too harshly. Around 12:30, my girl was off from her job and we drove back to my hotel. She did not speak any English but was very nice and sweet. She was in fact a bit shy but passionate, and I liked that. We had a good time. Next time, I'll just stay at this hotel (costs about $30/day) and everything will be perfect. This hotel is in the center of the city, off from the main tourist section along the Mekong river though.
- Vientianne Travel Report Dated Added: Mon Aug 27 2007 Submitted by: Anon
Alright, listen up: just came back from Laos, and here are my thoughts. First of all, yes, the law is there. Second of all, no, I doubt that many of the girls would have any compunction about turning your ass in. Third, don't fucking worry, you're fine. (Review # 20568)
As far as hobbying goes, I learned from a Tuktuk driver that they don't like the police either, really, because they'd rather have steady business than a one time bribe. Also, if you really are worried about it, just don't hobby here, it's pretty easy to get some. I wasn't even that proactive about it and got laid by two different chicks in Vang Vieng, not prozzies. Pro tip though: bring a condom. Lao girls seem to have no problem letting you slip it in raw, and you're probably going to be drunk so you won't either.
- Vientiane Other Dated Added: Sun May 20 2007 Submitted by: Anon
I was just reading review #17409 and wondering what the hell he is talking about. I was just in Vientiane last summer and I had no problem meeting a whole array of beautiful Loa women. They are friendly and kind and so good looking. So I am sitting here wondering why this guy would be saying this stuff and it came to me, he is an ex-pat protecting his stash.
These ex-pats are broke and the women don't want anything to do with them so what they do is scare us regular joes into not going to these places. Yes there is a law but is it enforced. NO! Just be careful it is a third world country and everyone is looking to make a buck. Once again the women are worth it and cheap (around $10 to 20 a night, no lie)
(Review # 19042)
- Vientiane Travel Report Dated Added: Sun Feb 11 2007 Submitted by: Anon
I've just stumbled across this site via a Google search about Vientiane - as I've just skim read most of the crap reported now I'll give you some facts. First off I live in Vientiane. As some have found out there is a law in Laos which forbids sex between Laos citizens and foreigners when not married (any foreigners’ not just westerns). So basically if you are stupid enough to pick up a girl and wonder in a costly hotel i.e. Lao Plaza, Taipan, Settha Palace etc. then basically you will get what you deserve which will as previously be describe be taken away by the police and fine. A law is a law regardless of if the law doesn't exist in your country! You not in the US or UK now your in Laos and it Laos laws. (Review # 17409)
As for people reporting you well hey if someone is breaking the law in your neighborhood do you just ignore it, particularly if it's a foreigner? If you go looking for girls ready to jump on a foreigner then you'll quickly understand they see you as a money ticket. But if you can speak Lao (like me) and you go to lesser tourist bars then you can meet a genuine Lao girl not just wanting money out of you (like my wife!). As for Don Chan Palace disco being forced to close early that was just for a couple of weeks.
It is now open until early hours again. Basically the main bar and discos you meet any girls in are: Don Chan Palace Nightclub Marina Nightclub Bor Pen Nyang Bar D-Music (Novotel) Future Joker Nightclub opposite the BCEL bank by the Mekhong (forget the name) Samlo Pub Kop Jai Deu - however they are trying more and more to dissaude girls and have large posters up saying so hopefully more bar will take this approach! Not complete but they are the main.
Personally I am very happy read people getting screwed over by the police! Then I don't have to suffer the same morons who have takeover parts of Bangkok, Pattaya etc. In short Vientiane and Laos has a 'scene' but it isn't established or legal in anyway so please go back to Thailand or Cambodia so people can go out and have a beer without you lot leching over anything that move.
- Vientiane Street Action Dated Added: Thu Jan 11 2007 Submitted by: Anon
Yes, the last guy is right about the extortion rackets. I absolutely adore pussy and I´ve sunk my Johnny in many countries over the years. As with most of us, I´ve put up with the bullshit of pimps or girls ripping me off every on the odd occasion. But nothing like what happened to me in Laos last September, 2006. Extortion is a serious issue in this country and the goverment officials/police are running it.
I was set up in my own hotel. The girl was going for about $55 and about a 7 or 8. They at least let me do the deed and when whe was about to leave, they burst in the door which was opened by the hotel manager. I was taken to the Vientiane police station and grilled and threatened with jail, paperwork, fingerprints... the lot. They proceeded to formally charge me as I spent a night of hell in jail. It was without doubt the worst night of my life.
The next day I started to offer money. I think most of you would do the same if you experienced what I did. Anyhow, the mood changed with the mention of money but obviously they had the upper hand in negotiations. Figured it was better than calling their bluff and rotting prison. I´ve since heard there are a few foreigners doing time there for having sex in the country with a Lao women. To cut a long story short, I paid $3000 for my release and immediately caught the next bus to Thailand. At least the hotel did not charge me for the night and who knows someone there probably got a cut of the money.
In retrospect, the fee might have been half if I acted immediately with an offer of money (before I reached the police station) but everything happened so fast and before I knew it, I was handcuffed and getting finger printed at the police station. I did try to mention money but they wouldn´t have a bar of it at the time. Maybe to wear me down or maybe to set up a price with those of higher rank.
Everything is about rank in these countries!!! I will never go to Laos again. Be careful lads the fact that I was staying at the second most expensive hotel in town. Tipping my tuk tuk driver and doorman well for girls in the days prior did not make it any safer in the end. In most countries, such generosity buys you more than adequate protection and sometimes damn good service. Laos might pretend to have opened to the world but it's still a communist country and these bastards are getting greedy.
(Review # 16965)
- Vientaine Travel Report Dated Added: Mon Jan 08 2007 Submitted by: Charlie
I have just left Laos in January 2007 after working in Vientaine for a year. I got to know the local sex trade fairly well. Having worked all over SE Asia, I personally consider the sex industry in Laos a bit of a dissapointment.
Here´s a bit of background information. As of the 2nd of December 2006 (essentially Lao National Day or something like that), a presidential decree was enacted that provides for the actual monetary reimbursement of informers´ providing advice in regard to tourists engaging Lao women for the sex trade. This adds to an already difficult climate for us happy-go-lucky red blooded guys. As mentioned in an earlier entry on this site, the going rate at the start (at least at the start of 2007) is about $US27 -30 for long time yet $15 (if your lucky) to $20 for short time. This is an enormous amount of money in Lao terms and I have had many argument in the local pubs as to why such a poor country charges so much.
The prices are basically on par with Bangkok - a few girls must have decided that this was better than $10-15 only 3 years ago and the rest followed suit. After a year in the city and living a particularly naughty life and can confidently say that the total number of full time girls working the streets of Vientaine (no bigger than a regional town) number less than 100 full time individuals, most are freelance although there is a couple of traditional mamasan places around. There are always the traditional girls but they are looking for marraige and a constant supply of dollars for just about every member of the family. Most ex-pats know this only too well.
The greatest myth (or perhaps misinterpretation of statistics) is that concerning the prevalence of AIDS. True --- it has one of the lowest infection rates in SE Asia among the general population. However, the relatively small number of sex workers cater to all the trade. They get a hammering and therefore the STI rate among these individuals is extremely high. You actually have more chance of contracting an STI in Laos than neighboring Cambodia whose public profile on STI is relatively notorious.
Few of the girls speak English so converstaion before and after is extremely limited. Worth noting is the fact that there is an increasing incidence of police working in with the girls to set up foreign tourits to extort money. Two Canadian guys were set up in the first week of January. The going rate for there release was $US500 or jail - I have this on good authority. An American was also set up the week before I left although I don´t know the buy out rate in his case. This extortion has been facilitated by the recent presidential decree and a pathetic socialist republic government. The fun police make sure everthing closes at 11:30, even the famous ¨Don Chan Palace whose night club used to be able to stay open to 3 AM has had the government peel the time back to 11:30. The place is dead by midnight.
Overall, Laos really isn´t worth it. Basically there´s more bang for your buck and a lot less worry in Thailand and Cambodia, which is why we ex-pats cross the border and head for Bangkok when we want to have a good time.
(Review # 16934)
- vientiane Travel Report Dated Added: Wed Aug 16 2006 Submitted by: Educated Consumer
One has better chance to get hurt in a car accident in Lao or get a food poisoning than to get hustled by police for having sex with a Lao woman, nevertheless, the law prohibiting sexual acts with a foreigners does exist and it will be applied to you if you piss off the wrong people or members of police force directly. Fortunately, itís easy to be nice to those friendly, mild-mannered people who would sell their daughters to the pimps for as little as $500 who would than retail them to tourists for $10 a shot ($6-7) for locals.
The law exists to curb that kind of activity, you see. Most girls who work the streets, bars and discos of Bangkok and Pattaya come from Northeast Thailand and are ethnic Lao, so if you familiar with the type, you better off staying in Thailand, you get the same shit there. But if you like the type and smartly decide to go straight to the source, to Northeast, visiting Vientiane is recommended. Itís a quaint little town more like a village than a nationís capital, only 20 minutes away from the border and you probably need to renew your visa anyway.
The problem with the girls is that they donít speak English, even those who went to high school and know the alphabet and stuff canít make a fucking conversation. Thai is widely understood, if you can speak it a little bit, I recommend disco called Future. Pretty young girls just having fun, but wouldnít pass the opportunity to make some money. Freelancers are usually more fun, although prices are on par with Thailand, $30-40 on an average and quoted in Thai baht. There is restaurant next door where you can pick up a girl easily (loud music doesnít make it easier with a language barrier) and you can see the girl better (discos are too fucking dark).
Marina disco is the most popular which means that on Friday and Saturday night its full of rich Lao guys, so you need to spend some dough. Company of the girl in a karaoke bar cost $2 per hour and average price of a drink is $2. Closing time is 1.30 am, so if you pay for her time, she would go out with you. Most inexpensive hotels or guesthouses will let you bring girls to the room, but be nice and give a clerk $5. I gave that bastard $4 and he bowed to me like I was a fucking secretary of their Communist Party.
If you cant speak any Lao or Thai at all, ask one of the tuk-tuk drivers who hang around tourist area on the riverside for "lady boom-boom". Price quoted was 1500 baht for a long time, 1000 for short one. That would include the drivers commission. A little expensive for one of the poorest countries in the world, but capitals are always like that. They always try to overcharge you in any capital if you donít speak the language. Donít expect a decent blow job in Lao, that shit aint part of their culture. Lao has a very low AIDS rate, so condoms are not widely used. Good thing or bad, up to you. (Review # 15354)
- Luang Pra Bang Escort Review Dated Added: Tue Jun 14 2005 Submitted by: Chinaman
June 25th, 2005-
I'm writting this about a year later as I visted Laos at the begining of last summer (2004). At the time I remember reading a lot on this site about "being careful" having an open associaion with Laos women. Total and complete BS. I just have no idea why people report things as fact that they "have heard", or some German backpacker told them one time or another in some bar somewhere.
Just use common sense... Do you think Laos would jail a tourist because he slept with a prostitute? What do you think is more important for the people in that area tourist dollars or a strict code of morals? Anyone guessing the later obviously hasn't done much travelling in South East asia (or has been doing so with their head directly up their ass).
Anyway again, the people who are spending 50$ on hookers in Laos are obviously the same people who are listening to drunk Germans tell you what they think they know in a bar somewhere. Again common sense goes a long way.
Simply put in Vient. or L P B, simply go up to any tuk-tuk driver and say "BOOM BOOM". He's going to take you to a place (and ya get a commission). Unfortunately, this is unavoidable in Laos because it's not in your face so you can't really simply follow your nose like in Thailand.
I did this with my friend (who wasn't interested in whoring just watching me make an idiot out of myself as usual) and the driver took us to a place at the end of the main night market road in LPB. WE stopped of at the place (which was right beside antoher whore house) and waited outside. The mamasan rushed 4 or 5 girls out to see us and the driver disappeared with the prettiest one (commission). We sat around and drank dollar beer for an hour or so until I had picked the one I wanted (same one the tuk-tuk had finished with; thank god for condoms). We negotiated jokingly with the girls and they ended up settling for 10$ short time. When I left we gave the other girls who had been entertaining my friend 10$ because she was a good drinking partner for him. Anyway it's pretty easy if you know the magic words.So don't worry about it. Laos girls don't speak English but they are friendly enough. Nice people. (Review # 11758)
- Vientiene Travel Report Dated Added: Thu Jun 02 2005 Submitted by: faz
There is loads of action to be had in Vientiene. Don't worry about the Policeas I never had any problems whatsoever in around 20 visits. Would just be a case of a small "service charge" if it ever did arise.
In Laos it really helps if you can speak Laos or Thai as most of the younger generation grew up on Thai TV. So many can speak Thai fluently. However there are a few girls who can speak a bit of English. Though these tend to be more hardened and experienced, they'll start talking money before you get them back to the hotel.
Best place would have to be Future, near the Novotel. This is a disco with plenty of girls around. There are a couple of other places very close by, which are much the same. Just a slight word of advice. If you pick out a honey, make sure to watch her and those around her for a while. Make sure she doesn't have a jealous boyfriend hanging around. Most of these places close around 1:00am.
Some of these girls will stay with you all night for free, but hey, loose you're pride and give them a 1000 Baht or whatever you think they are worth. They will appreciate it and they really do take good care of you.
Another place you can try are the Samlor Pub. A little later is better when some freelancers are hanging around. But personally, I don't like it for picking up but it's good for a cheap beer or two.
Also try Wind West, a big brown building on the road out to the Novotal which closes at 3am. Some freelancers to be had here.
After that you can still get a drink at the bowling alley, open 'til around 5am. But don't expect any single chicks there, better to take your own by that time. This place has the front lights off and the motorcycles parked inside.
There are also many Karaoke/Dancing venues, which are frequented by Laos guys only. But foreigners are very welcome with no hassles. I always ask the doormen before I go in. But behave yourself and don't start grabbing girls and the like. Really, you have to be able to speak at least some Thai in these places. Just tell the guys what kind of girl you want and she will be sat with you in no time. These girls don't get a salary, they just get something like 30 Baht an hour for sitting with customers. And they dress very nicely. I find the girls in these places are the best lookers and really take good care. They won't even ask you for a drink. But be nice and don't be cheap. The beer costs next to nothing up here. Because they are not salaried, they are free to leave with you if they like and feel comfortable. But if she says no, try the next place. Don't talk money, just give her what you feel she is worth in the morning as though it is a gift. I find slipping it in her handbag when she is half looking is best. Then there is no discussion.
There are other places where the Tuk-Tuk guys will always try and take you. These are dingy shophouses with a few girls out front. They are the typical smelly mattress in a room around the back type places. DON'T BOTHER! Ignore the Tuk-Tuk driver, he gets a tip of course and the price will end up being more than what you can get a freelancer for. Definitely not worth the hassle. (Review # 11645)
- Vientiane Escort Review Dated Added: Tue Jan 25 2005 Submitted by:
Vientiane seems to open up a bit though you have to be careful - go to Chess Cafť, it is a sort of dark disco where you can get in contact with hookers easily. Many of them don't speak English, but people in Laos are very helpful, so another guy might even translate for you (I had this experience...).
You can take the girl to a small hotel, they are used to it. I went to a nice and cheap hotel with a German speaking owner, unfortunately forgot the name. The girl was great, and it seems she didn't care about condoms which means you have to use them...
Gave her 1000 Baht and she was happy with it.
On the way in the tuk tuk avoid showing the police you know the girl - better sit in front with the driver and let the girl sit in the back. (Review # 10890)
- Vientiane Travel Report Dated Added: Tue Oct 08 2002 Submitted by: jingle jangle
I too have had some great free sex in Laos from one of the nightclubs called Future. I went in on my own and within a few minutes i was getting eyed up by a number of lovely local girls. A quick hello, an offer of a drink and you've scored. Be careful though as we got stopped by the police at gunpoint one night whilst in a tuk tuk with a local girl. The driver had to bribe the police to let us go. Meanwhile my girl told me not to speak to her in the tuk tuk as she was certain she could get arrested.
The police will not probably not want to arrest a falang for this but the local girls can technically still get into trouble.~~
~~Also remember like most places in asia, be nice to the girls and you might get a freebie. If in the morning you get hit for a bill then don't let it dent your ego and pay them, they really do need the money! You wont be the first prick to tell them that you dont have to pay for sex because you're so good in bed!!! (Review # 6261)
- Vientiane Escort Review Dated Added: Sat Nov 10 2001 Submitted by: Master
I spend one night in Vientiane in early November 2001. Here is the story: After reading about the Taipan Hotel, the Khop Jai Deu Restaurant and bar and Samlo Bar that's the direction I took. I found the hotel over-priced compared to other cities in Asia but took it anyway. Went out and had diner in Khop Jai Deu: Very good food, very good value! After diner hung around the bar for a while, nothing happening so I went to Samlo bar, only lady boys at that time. Decided to take a walk and met one woman in the street who was the first Lao woman who visibly wanted some interaction with a foreigner. After a better look she seemed a bit tired looking and I wondered whether she was maybe the only available female and that made her look like so^-^
~~~~~~Went back to Khop Jai Deu, it was full of foreigners of all sizes and sexes but the only Lao where the ones serving there. About to give up for the day I went for another look at Samlo bar and this time I spotted 3 girls who had just come in. They looked like any girls out for a night on the town, no profs at all. I smiled, they smiled so I went over and asked if they wanted to join me upstairs to play pool. They accepted and so I ordered drinks all around and we played a few games. Meanwhile I chatted up the best looker. She seemed very shy and when after three games I said I was going to my hotel and invited her to come she actually colored red in the face but she accepted.
~~~~~~ When I walked in to the lobby of Taipan hotel I got very stern looks from the staff at reception and was told in very clear and firm way that no visitors where allowed after 6 pm. I tried to convince them to let it pass just this once, I showed some money but nothing doing! As I started to see enjoying the night with this beautiful girl as just a dream we met a tuktuk driver at the entry of the hotel who proposed me to take us to a guesthouse he knew where there would be no problem. Indeed for 600 Baht we got a room almost as good as in Taipan and no questions asked. So sorry I don't know the name of the place but I think that other drivers would know their places as they probably get a commission. I am not one to talk out of bed but I will not forget my night in Vientiane, nor my sweet and beautiful companion of that night!
~~~~~~I am looking forward to go back soon, I think I'm in love (again). Good times to all.~~ (Review # 4594)
- Vientiane Travel Report Dated Added: Tue Jun 12 2001 Submitted by: Anon
The previous posters warnings about Laos being a commie country and $1000 fine and jail terms and the like is complete HORSESHIT.
On my last visit to Vientiane, I was just strolling around town by myself, and had just purchased a couple of sticky rolls from one of the MANY fine bakeries in Vientiane. Then, out of the blue, there are a couple of delicious looking young ladies on bicycles (this is 11pm) saying HEEEYYYLOOOOO! to me as they ride bike. I had nothing to do, so I commandeered her bike, put the gal on the back, and then bicycled all around town with the cuter of the two on the bike of the bike (her bicycle). We ride all around town, past police checkpoints, around "restricted" government buildings, etc., etc.
The Lao (commie) police just smile and wave! I literally carried the younger, cuter gal up to my room in my small hotel and f*$#ed the bejesus out of her, FOR FREE. GOTTA LOVE LAOS!!!! (Review # 3729)
- Vientiane Travel Report Dated Added: Fri Feb 16 2001 Submitted by: zsczsc
I went to Vientiane, Laos in January 2001. I was staying at the Tai Pan Hotel for USD 49.00 (inclusive breakfast and airport shuttle bus roundtrip). I booked it through the internet. The rooms are nice, big and clean. Generally speaking Laos is comparable with Thailand 30 years ago: cheap, unspoiled, beautiful scenery and pretty girls.
Now about the "interesting" part: The Laos girls look like Thai girls! Pretty, young and horny. They are very eager to meet foreigners and they do everything for you.
Go around 7.00 pm to the Khop Chai Dev Food Garden, Nam Phu Square at Setthathirath Road. It is a restaurant in a nice garden and has live music, both local and later in the evening international music. Go to the bar and after 7.30 pm the girls are joining. The beer is cheap (2 liters for about 12000 Kip or less then 2 USD). The girls speak English. You can pick one and go to your hotel room or they prefer to go first to one of the international discos were you find plenty more pretty girls waiting for you. The "first night girl" asked for 200'000 Kip or USD 25.00 ( 8000 Kip = 1 USD) which I immediately agreed to pay since she was one of the prettiest girl I have ever seen. She was very exited that she got that amount of money. And I tell you she was worth it! We had sex several times. She was a horny bitch and she did everything a man can dream of. Her pussy was nicely shaved (not the long hairs Thai or Chinese girls sometimes have) and she was wet, wet, wet. When she took of her sexy black g-string, it was all wet already.
Another good place to meet your "girl-friend for the night" is the Samlao pub also located at Setthathirath road opposite "Vat Ont Teu" temple. Ask for Paul (an Englishman) at the bar. He is the owner and since 9 years in Laos. He can tell you more about the country and "interesting" things to do. The second girl I had asked for 150'000 Kip ( 19 USD) it she was worth it again. She was horny and she wanted it anal only. She was screaming all the time and I think all the other hotel guests could hear us. ~~This was my first trip to Laos but surely not the last....~~ (Review # 3169)
- Vientiane Travel Report Dated Added: Wed Dec 06 2000 Submitted by: Gopher
I was in Vientiane in June of 2000, and while I didn't check out the scene thoroughly (I had brought some entertainment along with me from Bangkok because I wasn't sure what to expect), there did seem to be some action available. Let it be said that Vientiane, while not the most exciting or modern place on earth, has a very serene, relaxing quality about it (when bombs aren't going off) and some great food (and cheap!). If you're looking to get away from the hustle and bustle of places like Bangkok, this is a nice place.
I stayed at the Hotel Novotel, which was the nicest place in town (around $70/night). It's a newer, clean hotel with good service. They have a night club in the hotel and there were many women, most in the 6-9 range, that were available for the evening. Laotian women are fairly pretty and generally look like the Vietnamese. It is a very poor country though so they are sometimes not as well maintained (clothes, hair, make-up, etc.) as some of the other Asian countries, but still very presentable and very sexy if you like Asian women. I did not price it out (as I said above I already had my own entertainment), but I would assume Thailand-or-cheaper type prices ($20-$50 for the night). The Laotian currency is extremely depressed and everything in this country is CHEAP, so I would not expect the action to be any different.
Beware that Laos is still a communist country (technically) and has stiff penalties for engaging in prostitution or sex of any nature with an unmarried woman. The bartender at the Novotel told me that if one was caught on the street with a local woman, the fine was $1000 and 30 days in jail or something like that. I'm not sure how true this is (and I would expect that one could bribe one's way out of it without too much difficulty given the extremely poor state of the economy there), but be cautious. It may be that the bartender's ulterior motive was to get me to go to their nightclub, but who knows. It may pay to just stay at a place like the Novotel where you don't have to leave the premises to get what you need. (Review # 2824)